Add modules to Cardinal

[dromer]

I thought it would be good to start a topic with suggestions of modules that could be included.

Main guideline would be to try and pick only foss modules that allow redistribution of assets to make life easy on us.
Source should be CC0, GPL3+, MIT, or BSD and assets should have opensource licensing. If graphics has ND clause we need to get consent for dark/light panel translation.

(GPL3 currently works, but module vendors should be encouraged to use more permissive license for future versions of the GPL)

Please add suggestions to the wiki page

[falkTX]

This should be a wiki, not a discussion or ticket.
Also CC-NC restriction is too late, 99% of Rack modules use this.

Just go to https://github.com/DISTRHO/Cardinal/wiki/Possible-modules-to-include and use that.
Please dont request modules here.

[falkTX]

Adding note of https://grough.github.io/lilac-loop-vcv/ which is not something we have yet.

Also https://github.com/Miserlou/RJModules/ might be cool

[dromer]

Axioma has interesting modules and just released for v2 engine: https://github.com/kauewerner/Axioma
Is licensed. GPL-3.0-or-later.

[RO-mix]

https://library.vcvrack.com/Extratone

[RO-mix]

https://library.vcvrack.com/Dintree-Virtual

[RO-mix]

https://library.vcvrack.com/WeldSplatter

[dromer]

1. please link to the source not the vcv library as it otherwise makes reviewing the code and license much harder
2. you can edit your original post, this makes reading this discussion much easier
3. many I already posted below in such fashion
4. some that you are linking are already included in Cardinal (Extratone/XTRTN for instance)

[falkTX]

This is a bit too much, wow.
Please dont just spam such links, we need reasons for adding new modules.

Forwards and backwards compatibility are very important.
Once 1.0 is tagged, we cant remove modules anymore no matter how bad they turn out to be.

and FYI I am hiding this whole thread since it mostly contains library links, we cant use as-is.

[falkTX]

yeah, lets revisit and try to integrated once it gets a proper release or at least early public status

[falkTX]

I have took this info and put it on the wiki, see https://github.com/DISTRHO/Cardinal/wiki/Possible-modules-to-include

Having this as discussion is going to be painful to sort out later, so let's just use something proper where we can track things.

Will leave this topic going for discussion around it for now, but any new modules mentioned should instead go to the wiki

[offthesky]

as for getting the problematic artworks sorted out for those called out on your wiki list: was a graphic artist for almost 20 years (before going into sound design) - i'd like to take a stab at it, if someone isn't already? perhaps there is there a discuss about this going on already somewhere else?

[falkTX]

There is an IRC channel as mentioned in the README, otherwise what happens on the tickets is the important stuff.
I had someone who proposed to redo the Fundamental panels so we could have those modules, but he has been silent since more than 1month, so I don't expect that to happen from his side anymore.

Redoing fundamental panels from scratch is likely the most useful thing now.
It can't be a reskin of the public ones, needs to be distinct enough to be their own custom panels.

[offthesky]

makes sense about starting w the fundamental set and also it needing to look/be original (and be complete free to use in perpetuity). i'm assuming we can use the same width/basic knob & input/output placement for all the modules. looking at the fundamental panels in rack pro, as well as evaluating what they did with the AS set in mirack, seems like 2-3 days work here for the fundamental ones. i'd opt to keep things flat and dark (a la valhalla plugins). ive read the https://vcvrack.com/manual/Panel and it sounds fairly straight forward. would i just then handoff the inkscape projects to you? guessing the nitty gritty of this (like how to handle animating the leds on the sum/record modules) would be better discussed in irc. which ive never used - is there an irc app you'd recommend? otherwise im fine to just keep hashing it out here in the discussion thread.

[falkTX]

I dont know which IRC clients to recommend on windows to be honest, doing an online search would be your best approach. But we can keep the discussion here too.

I am not sure if redoing the panels with their exact positions is a good idea tbh, as Fundamental license in theory applies to the "visual design" of the panels, so not simply graphics. How much this is even legal I do not know.
From my talks with Andrew, I am lead to think he wouldn't mind new panels from scratch even if they have the same position.

The best approach here seems to be to do 1 module as an example/test, then get some feedback from him and the community, checking if they think the new panel(s) are similar enough to count as derivative work.

My only request is for you to make panels which are dark-mode friendly. Doesn't have to be pure black, just something easy on the eyes.

[offthesky]

absolutely no problem on all counts: 1.) doing a test and getting yours/andrew's approval (i assume you can mediate there w him as you already know and have rapport) 2.) changing up the knob/input/output positions and 3.) dark mode friendly -goes without saying for cardinal ;]

i'd love to at least keep the panel widths all the same?: i.e. noise can stay 3hp, random stay's 9hp, etc. but i can easily change things up enough to otherwise make them look like a unique brand (and i'll be 100% open to yours/andrew's thoughts on changes to help get them all the way). for example: use knobs instead of sliders, dots instead of piano keys on the QNT. stuff like that. i'll put together a png mockup of the ADSR, QNT, WT LFO, and SUM as those have, i think, the most identifiable elements as far as getting andrew's okay.

open to your thoughts on all that...

[falkTX]

you have full creative freedom :)
Me and many others can give opinions along the way.

thanks in advance!

[offthesky]

would something like this work to get the conversation w andrew going? it's def not trying to be as good as the current fundamental ones (i.e. the adsr diagram on the adsr module is meant to be static). but at least (hopefully) it's comparable to what's already in the library and fitting for the cardinal aesthetic. wasn't sure if i needed to include the vcv logo in on these so left them out for now...

.

[falkTX]

dont know where Rack installs things, but https://github.com/VCVRack/Fundamental/tree/v2/res has the original svg files

[offthesky]

okay cool, ty! will check that out

[offthesky]

also, just want to double confirm that we got an okay from andrew on this... before going down the rabbit hole.

[falkTX]

he doesnt have to say yes. we are replacing some files without infringing on rights or visual design.
the source code is licensed under GPLv3+, so we can simply use fundamental based on that license, which is the most important part anyway.

worst case we end up creating a full on fork instead of simply replacing the panels.

[offthesky]

gotcha. i'll be reaching out to you soon via email with assets/questions..

[ulibs66]

I would really love to see Formula by Frank Buss to be implemented. It is under BSD-2-Clause license. I suspect that is incompatible but I am not sure. If it is I would try to convince the dev to change the licensing to something compatible. It is really very versatile for combining control voltages from two sources in a weighted fashion. It has a ton of other use cases (see https://github.com/FrankBuss/FrankBussRackPlugin/blob/master/docs/formula.md).

The library link is here:

[](https://library.vcvrack.com/FrankBuss/Formula)

The source: https://github.com/FrankBuss/FrankBussRackPlugin/tree/master/src

Any chance?

[dromer]

Why would BSD-2-Clause be incompatible?

I'd say this is very doable. Doesn't seem to have any specific artwork license so no issues to modify the panels for dark-mode.
Just needs someone to do the work and then see if the CI can handle it ... (we are reaching the limits of what we can actually build using github).

Best would be to add this to the table on the wiki so it can be tracked better.

[ulibs66]

Dear dromer: really happy to hear this!

"Best would be to add this to the table on the wiki so it can be tracked better."

Um - sorry I am a complete noob - can I do something to make that happen(i. e. add this to the table on the wiki)?

[dromer]

https://github.com/DISTRHO/Cardinal/wiki/Possible-modules-to-include

[ulibs66]

OK - done! Took me a while to understand what to do ...
THX!

[subderground]

The great RPJ pack (44modules) is updated and is always GPL3 or later :-)
And there is also LFMEmbeded/LFMFull inside (ProjectM module with CV ;-) )

[dromer]

LFMEmbedded is part of a separate plugin -> https://github.com/kockie69/Visualizer

[subderground]

Hi,
Just for the info, Surge (modules pack) beta has been updated (I think Surge was already in the wiki.)
What a great work made by the devs Pyer Cllrd (Geodesics, VCV) and Steve Baker (MindMeld) ! :-)))
Check the demo by Omri Cohen here : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MavXLbI50A
Greetings.

[offthesky]

i spoke with docb about getting the license for his csound module to be update to be able to be added to cardinal, he says it already is 3.0-later? could be interesting and fun to have some live coding ability in cardinal:

docb/dbRackCsound#7

[GBaige]

it is now added in nightly (github actions) builds!

This is exciting! It'd also be nice to be able to visibly hide modules in the patch and keep only macros/controller modules visible, I think it would compliment the new modules and free the screen of clutter, it would be perfect for live performances.

[dromer]

Is this a feature request? Because this diverts from how Rack works so I'm not sure how you think this would then be implemented.

[PaleSkinnySwede]

it is now added in nightly (github actions) builds!

This is exciting! It'd also be nice to be able to visibly hide modules in the patch and keep only macros/controller modules visible, I think it would compliment the new modules and free the screen of clutter, it would be perfect for live performances.

Just move them to rows off screen. I mean. The rack is huge and even on a 4k monitor at 100% you’d have rows not visible.

[GBaige]

Is this a feature request? Because this diverts from how Rack works so I'm not sure how you think this would then be implemented.

So what if it does? (Also, right-click > hide module...? shrugs)

It's a fair feature request. Cardinal is slowly becoming its own thing, and already has a few key differences with Rack. Why do you want it to adhere to Rack so much? It's just holding the project back.

Also the modules' graphics/UI is still being processed even if they're off-screen, hiding them would free up a lot of CPU.

While we're here, please take a look at the issues I've submitted. It's annoying, they're fair too and have gonr largely ignored.

[dromer]

Not ignored, just low priority or not able to reproduce.

It's not nice making demands that make developers' lives difficult.
Either contribute with code or accept that others won't do the implementation.

Anyway this discussion page is not the place for your requests.

[falkTX]

Cardinal tries to follow VCV Rack as much as possible. There are only a few scenarios where we disagree with VCV's technical approaches that we see changes on.

Regarding issues, as mentioned in https://github.com/DISTRHO/Cardinal/blob/main/docs/DIFFERENCES.md there is no support whatsoever for Cardinal modules or features. And we cannot exchange currency or other means of support, due to many modules having non-commercial terms in them.
But unlike VCV/Rack, contributions in terms of code and fixes are very welcome!

[RedstoneParadox]

Any chance we could get Infrasonic Audio's Warp Core in Cardinal? Its license is GPLv3+

[korg-supporter13]

Is there a reason that CV Mix from VCV isn't in Cardinal yet? I want to modulate an oscillator with an LFO and FM at the same time, but the LFO acts wonky in the Befaco mixer (and I contacted them about it).

[falkTX]

someone needs to do the work of porting over the redesigns. I have been meaning to do it, but always other stuff takes priority.
do you want to take this task?

[korg-supporter13]

Unfortunately, I don't have any graphic design skills, but thanks for the answer.

[falkTX]

the graphics are already done, we mostly need coding to adapt and match the svgs to the rest of the module code.

[korg-supporter13]

I can't do that either. I was only asking bc I was curious.

[avianArsonist]

would it be possible to add studio six + one? license seems to be gpl-3.0 or later

[dromer]

Add it to the wiki page with some reasons why it should be included.

Because we have more or less reached the limits of what we can build on free resources new modules really need to be a must-have to be considered. Either way add it to the wiki so it can be tracked.

[Grupletruge]

Any chance we'll ever see Airwin2Rack added to Cardinal? I'm no coder, but if theres anything else to do I'd be happy to help, theres so many great sounds we could get out of this.

[subderground]

I've added "Sickozell" & "Sparkette" stuffs to the wiki.
And I just notice only now that a "Milkdrop visualizer with CV inputs" is available in VCV (" https://github.com/kockie69/Visualizer/blob/main/docs/lowfatmilk.md ". It is allways in the wiki list.) For now I often use the nice "DISTRHO ProM" to make little INSTA REELs, but a modular version in Cardinal would be really appreciate. Many Thanks.

[dromer]

I've briefly looked into Visualizer last year, but it's a bit non-trivial to add and build and make the binary much bigger too.

Indeed might as well use ProM and then be able to run it full screen on a dedicated window!

[subderground]

Thanks for the info about Lofatmilk (perheaps the dev' will clean the code in the future🫠). Btw, ProM (LV2) does a great job but not tweakable with CV or automation.🤗

Do you know a module with the possibility to open a picture/image from HDrive ?
Many Thanks.

[dromer]

It's not about cleanness, but it adds some big dependencies into Cardinal and make the binary much bigger. All for a couple pretty colors.
I think it's better to not expect such functionality to be directly integrated.

If you are on Linux there is the "secret" mpv module that can load media files :)

[subderground]

Yep, but I'm on Win11.😀 Computerscare has a module ''Custom Blank' witch can load jpeg png...pictures but it's BSD3 CLAUSE. 😉 Don't worry, making music is the real deal 🤘

[washikano]

Computerscare modules are pretty fun. I tried to add them to Cardinal and then make a pull request but I kept getting "‘OSDIALOG_OPEN’ was not declared" errors. Eventually I gave up, but I'd love to see computerscare in Cardinal,. especially the Moly Patrix and the custom animated blank and its related extensions. It's already in the wiki list for possible modules to add, since BSD3-Clause is compatible with GPLv3.0-or-later.

[dromer]

(starting new comment thread for new modules)

@washikano This means you have to patch the modules to use the asynchronous file dialogs.

Example from lilac-loop: grough/lilac-loop-vcv@cf9bb5c#diff-eb5a62a53d87fff3b08dfb6d040e65e0443385a1da58b8dcfa3b4ff5810949a3R181-R199

[washikano]

I can't believe it @dromer , it's compiling. It's actually compiling. Thank you so much, I looked at the example you posted but ended up looking at how it was done for Fundamental Wavetable and that gave me what I needed. Honestly, man, I can't thank you enough.

[washikano]

Well, there it is. I'm currently on Debian 12, haven't tested if it works on Windows yet. Once again thank you so much @dromer for pointing me in the right direction. There's still some things to fix, for instance there's knobs and parts of the background that are missing in some modules, but once I'm through with that I'll make a PR.

[dromer]

It would of course also be nice to add "dark panels" to these, however this will need a bit of specific tweaking to properly accomplish and can be done after the PR.

[Blaafot]

Hi! What are the chances of having this module in cardinal? It`s submitted for inclusion in the VCV library. https://github.com/Paul-Dempsey/pachde-hc-one/releases/tag/v2.0.0
Best regards Imaginus

[dromer]

What do these do exactly? They connect directly to EaganMatrix devices?

I don't think these would be very useful to the majority of users. Being a niche within a niche and possibly requiring direct access to these devices they may not even work in the plugin context?

Probably the chances are very low.

[Blaafot]

Yes they connect directly to Eagan Matrix. I understand it's very niche, but I thought somehow that it might be easy to add it or that it would be added "automatically" as it is free and part of VCV. But I guess i don't have a good knowledge of how these processes happen. Thankx for the answer and keep up the good work!