Attic Spiral Staircase

[nelsonic]

Todo

• Convert idea into 3D model / CAD design
  • Remove step 17 as it does not fit Attic Spiral Staircase #30 (comment)
  • Increase height of steps 10 - 16 by 11mm to compensate removal of step 17. Attic Spiral Staircase #30 (comment)
  • re-draw walls and attic hole to contextualise
  • draw hand rails
  • render the 3D design pngs for printing. see: Attic Spiral Staircase #30 (comment)
• Request quote from metal-worker

October 2019 - Fusion 360 Re-Draw

• Re-draw the staircase in metal, wood and glass (28th iteration)
• Re-send design (link to online model!) to suppliers for revised quote

Some amazing designs in this list: https://casaeconstrucao.org/escadas/escada-caracol

Implementation Tasks

• Find a supplier
• Request quotes by sending drawings
• On-site visit to fine-tune quotes through questions and measure space
• Accept quotes and green-light work
• Frame made
• Frame installed
• Steps cut STEPS for Attic Spiral Staircase  #129
• Steps assembled ASSEMBLE Attic Spiral Staircase Steps #136
• Moulds taken for glass
  Final floor boards to be put in (Carlos Pinheiro) separate non-dependent issue.
• Flooring adapted to fix pilar and steps to the floor
• Glass manufactured
• Glass installation booked
• Glass installed

[nelsonic]

Wireframe:

[nelsonic]

Searched for: "height rise staircase cm"
found: https://www.levelmaster.com.au/stair-calculator-stair-stringers/

https://www.levelmaster.com.au/wp-content/uploads/1-step-stringer-Drawing.jpg

[nelsonic]

Using Hollow Mild Steel Tube to construct the frame/structure for the staircase:

The rectangular tubing on the right to be specific.

Searched for: "rectangular tube sizes and weights"
found: https://www.metalsupplies.com/products/mild-steel-hollow-section

Using: 80 X 40 X 5MM (RHS) RECTANGULAR STEEL HOLLOW SECTION (8.13 KG/M)

[nelsonic]

Hand Rails?

Hand rail heigh: https://www.thespruce.com/stair-handrail-and-guard-code-1822015

obviously the site is American so all measurements are in inches... 🙄

The only measurement I'm interested in is "handrail height: 34 - 38 inches" (86.36 - 96.52 cm)
and the mid-term of 36 inches (91.44cm)

http://www.cbm.pi.gov.br/download/201404/CBM16_8f22b5db6d.pdf

The height of the hand rail is 92cm. That's what I'm going with.

[nelsonic]

You know when you think a task will only take "a couple of hours" ⏳
but it ends up being a "pandora's box" that takes 10x more time...?! 🙄

I did effectively "timebox" the task and remained focussed for the full amount of time I allocated to it.
I just woefully over-estimated my SketchUp speed and by the time I was getting into the "flow state" doing the 3D drawing, everyone was intent on interrupt my "flow".
I ended up spending 7 hours straight drawing only taking brief breaks for bathroom and water-bottle refills, but eventually got sucked into lunch with family.
And then when I got back to my desk there were 10 other things competing for my limited attention.

Side Note on Deep/Focus Work

One of the most frustrating things in (my) life is when the people who do not "produce" (creative work), and therefore do not understand what it takes to enter "deep work focus", insist on constantly interrupting the people who are desperately trying to focus. 😞

When the interruptions are for trivial things that have zero long-term importance/significance but must be discussed immediately, I increasingly feel like I am suppressing my rage. 😡

When children do it (because they do not yet understand the value of time or the scarcity of "focussed deep work"), that's totally understandable. As an adult, I cannot reasonably expect a person who has never felt extreme shortage of time to grasp that "focus time" is finite and fleeting, so my patience continues to be limitless for them. (if you don't know me, you won't realise how patient I am when it comes to the people in my life ... you may only see the "breaking of the camels back" event and think I am pathologically impatient, but the fact is that I consistently try for years to communicate with people in multiple ways and only "give up" after 20+ attempts!)

But the Adults who constantly complain that they don't have "enough time" (while still burning through 7-10h per week on TV or other mindless entertainment) constantly interrupt me when they can see that I am trying to do something on my computer that is clearly not admin, email/chat or other shallow "busywork" ... I feel immensely frustrated and want to escape the tyranny of the un-creative.

tl;dr > Moving On!

Anyway, I will finish my work on the Attic Spiral Stair Case and it will be considerably better than something a professional interior designer or experienced architect would conceive of.

The reason it's taking me a lot longer is that I am paying massive attention to detail and methodically taking the time to draw that detail so that the "metal shop" we are paying to manufacture the staircase has zero reason to get it wrong ... i.e. I'm taking as much "ambiguity" out of the "build phase" as possible by putting all of my effort into the Design.
This is "waterfall" because it is the only way the people we are working with understand how to work. 😞

[codeanpeace]

Great side note on deep work!

Regarding the "waterfall" comment, I wonder how much of that the cost of agile being much higher for manufacturers of physical objects made out of metal. Or is it just historic/legacy process – it's just the way it's always been done? Thinking out loud, I wonder if they could iterate on smaller scale prototypes. Is that possible given the tooling/equipment in metal shops? 🤔

[nelsonic]

@codeanpeace It's mostly a historic/legacy mindset.
Most of the world is not "agile" in the way they think much less in the way they get their work done.
I totally understand in the case of metal work where having precise dimensions saves time/materials.
Having done metal fabrication, I feel that this staircase will take about a week to manufacture.
If one measurement in the design is "off" then the whole thing will be off.
So getting this "right" up-front is the only way of saving time/materials in the long-run.
Also it's a question of availability, the metal shop do not want to "stop-and-start" the work,
they want to do it all in one go. Again, this is understandable as they need to plan their workflow.
In software we can afford to be way more flexible because there is no "storage cost" for work-in-progress; the only "cost" we have is cognitive "task switching time"; which is comparatively simple.

[nelsonic]

20180405-plantas-electricidade-REV02-Francisca-FINAL.pdf

[codeanpeace]

Agreed, lots of good call outs there. The "question of availability" reminded me of the cost of context switching in creative deep work.

When do you think you guys will open if you don't mind me asking?
(please point me to the right channel for inquiry if/since this is probably not it)

[nelsonic]

I'm still busy editing the "making of" video but here's a screen cap:

[nelsonic]

@iteles I have a question regarding the ergonomics of the Spiral Staircase:
When a "user" reaches the 3^rd step, the 13^th step "sticks out" 20cm above the person's head and the height between the 3^rd step, the 13^th step is 1695mm (169.5cm). The height between the top of the 3^rd and bottomor of the 14^th step is 1870mm (187cm) this means 90% of people around the world will "clear" it. (see below)

This is much easier to understand/explain if you either look at the drawings below: (or visit my desk)

Not trying to "decapitate" the human in this render, just to show you which are the 13^th and 14^th steps respectively:

Essentially if people use the stairs in a "normal" way, i.e. they walk in the middle of the stairs,
there is no problem because the 13^th step does not "stick out" far enough to interfere withe the person's head and the 14^th step is high enough that 90+% of people will clear it.

via: https://www.researchgate.net/figure/10th-50th-and-90th-mass-and-height-percentiles-for-male-and-female-adults-for-Caucasian_tbl1_51180593

With the exception of a few giants from the Netherlands 🇳🇱🙄,
the gap between the 3^rd and 14^th step will be fine for 90% of people.
I feel that the ceiling height in the Attic rooms will be the bigger "constraint" for the taller people.

What do you think? 🤔

[iteles]

I don't think that the 14th step is an issue, although there is a chance that as you're going down the stairs you're actually bouncing (and on a bounce up there's always the danger you hit your forehead if you aren't paying attention), so we need to coat that stair in something spongey anyway just as a preventative measure.

My concern would be for the 13th step, which people could also hit the back of their head on when they're heading up the stairs and not really seeing it.

Two things that may ameliorate the situation would be:

• Increase the height of each step from steps 10 to 17 so that even if step 17 is flush with the floor of the attic, that's not an issue
• Increasing the width of steps 1 to 4 so that people side-step the problem as they will be going up and down next to the railing which will essentially pull them away from the steps

What do you think? Would either of those help?

P.S. This drawing is awesome! 🚀

[nelsonic]

For reference, this is the spiral staircase we had considered from Leroy:

http://www.leroymerlin.pt/Site/Produtos/Madeiras/Escadas/Escadas-de-interior/13925331.aspx

158cm is the diameter. Each step is 75cm which conforms to the "Regulations" as does the rail heigh and spacing between each vertical bar (cannot be more than 10cm wide so people cannot get their heads stuck between bars...)

Side note: what's up with Leroy Merlin's website being "Not Secure"...? 😕

@iteles I feel that we should seriously consider this staircase from Leroy and "adapt" it to our needs by extending the central pilar to the full height of the attic ceiling.
The only reason we did not consider it before was because we need the first and last steps to be offset (as per my drawing), but I think we should re-imagine it next time we visit @home and see if we can make this "store bought" one "work" to save both time and uncertainty.

Thoughts?

[iteles]

I think I need to be in the spot of the staircase to consider it properly.

I would say that it's pretty much the same price as a custom built one, so if we're going to have to adapt it anyway, it may be worth our while basing the design on this but just getting our one built from the get-go.

Let's check it out on Monday when we're @home for meetings with the electrician, plumbers & architect 👍

[nelsonic]

@iteles the 118cm version (ignore the color) fits our dimensions/needs better:

http://www.leroymerlin.pt/Site/Produtos/Madeiras/Escadas/Escadas-de-interior/13928474.aspx

I "vote" that we visit LM on Monday and discuss our needs with the (hopefully knowledgeable/competent) people in the store and see if we can make this work.

I agree that the price of the store-bought stairs is similar to the custom-built on the surface.
But you are only looking at the "quote" price, not the time it's going to take "back-and-forth"
or the probability that the custom-build will conform to all regulations.
The last thing we need/want is someone from the council vetoing our "alojamento local" request because the stairs aren't perfect which then would mean we have to rip out the custom-build and go back to the drawing board.

https://www.loftcentre.co.uk/fontanot-oak-90-adjustable-modular-stair-kit

[iteles]

We are 50% of the way there, but production has been halted whilst the government attempts to get a handle on the coronavirus spread in Portugal.

[iteles]

Downgraded to p2 but completely out of our hands. All workers in the metalworking part of the factory are home and the glass section is working at half mast.

I have requested that the glass be completed and put to one side asap and will call back in 2 weeks to check on the situation post initial quarantine.

[iteles]

Everyone is expected to be back to work next Monday and the majority of the stairs have been completed.

_Tentatively, the setup of the stairs in position have been scheduled for Monday 27-Apr-2020.

On Tuesday I need to call them to:

• Confirm that the finish on the staircase should be white
• Get a final date for the installation of the stairs so that we can book in moving ahead with Main staircase #120

[nelsonic]

@iteles to be clear: the "finish" of the metal is White in the design above for simplicity.
I think if it's painted a durable white then it will be relatively easy to maintain clean.
I would obviously have preferred the whole thing to be made in stainless steel but that would have probably cost 3x more and been more difficult for them to build.

[iteles]

The two gentlemen who have been building the staircase are still out sick although one of them was supposed to come back this week (he still hasn't). I'm due to call again on Friday to see what the situation is.

[nelsonic]

@iteles thanks for following up. 👍 Hope they both get well soon! 😷

[iteles]

Looks like this will finally be installed on 20-May-2020. 🎉

[iteles]

Staircase installed 🎉

Apparently they now need to still do the moulds for the glass (I don't understand why this wasn't done on the day it was installed) but have asked that the wooden steps are installed first so that will be the next 'step' (chortle, chortle)

[nelsonic]

This is what the steel frame of the stairs looks like in situ:



Obviously the central support pillar was not supposed to stick out from the floor like that ... 🤦
(so we will need a workaround for that...)

None of the dimensions match what I specified in the design that I painstakingly took many hours to get right. 😕
So now I have to re-measure and re-draw all the steps to fit with the inaccurate metal frame. 📏

[iteles]

The current idea is apparently for the moulds for the attic staircase glass to be taken tomorrow after the main staircase steps are installed: #120 (comment)

[nelsonic]

@iteles please insist with them that they need to remedy the central pillar overhang before any Glass is made. 😕

[iteles]

👍 Completely agree. You'll need to be there too in order to agree on whatever solution is discussed though.

[nelsonic]

Assembly: #136

[iteles]

On Friday 7-Jul-2020, the moulds were taken for the glass.

We had a few conversations around avoiding big step-ups in the glass to make the journey more fluid for hands following along the banister top and ensuring safety for the side of the stairs that opens out over the main stairs. 95% remained exactly the same as @nelsonic's original design for the glass.

The glass should now be manufactured whilst we speak to the metal-worker to determine what needs to be done to add to the flooring under the central pillar.

[nelsonic]

The Steps are Done. ✅

I’ve deliberately left the “flaps” unglued in case any of the steps need to be removed for any reason in the next couple of weeks: (while the glaziers are fitting the glass panels)

Once the glass is in, I will be using 3M double sided tape (already purchased) to stick the flaps (non-permanently) to the white frame to hide all the fixings so the steps “float” without visible bolts.

The view from the top:

Now we just need the glass and the central column "fix". ⏳

[iteles]

I love the steps so much 😍

Everyone is on holiday at the moment but I organised with Carlos (the company owner) that I would call him again on Monday to book in a day for one of his workers to come and discuss potential solutions with us, so that we can then discuss, agree and get a move on with this.

[nelsonic]

With Glasss:

[iteles]

Such a fan of how this turned out ❤️
Now has, glass, silicone and is fixed to the floor.

The carpenter (Chico) will be coming over next week to finalise the portion of flooring we're missing and tidy up the wooden strip.