Revolutionaries 2.0: The CentComm Uplink Console (New win-condition) #136
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I copy-pasta'd in the HTML formatting from my Markdown editor so uh the description is fucked, sorry. Just to clarify from the TL;DR - the timer can only be started by a Head Rev, so that ID's the round. |
| # TL;DR | ||
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| The current "kill all Heads" win condition for Revolutionaries is replaced. | ||
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| The bridge Communications Computer is upgraded to a Centcomm Security Uplink terminal. | ||
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| This terminal is pretty hard to destroy, internally-powered, bolted to the floor and very heavy. If the terminal somehow gets destroyed (a Singuloose, immovable rod, etc) then CentComm will detect this and dispatch the needed machine board to make another to the trade station. | ||
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| This Computer works like a Communications Computer, but represents the station's connection to CentComm. This connection can be switched off by inserting one of a set of keycards: one of the original Department Head IDs (but not the Captain's spare). This starts a timer. Each additional Head ID reduces this timer. The timer can be disabled by accessing the terminal and cancelling it. | ||
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| If this timer expires, and it's a Revs round, the Revs win. Even if it isn't, all cards on the station automatically become All Access. | ||
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What's to stop heads just destroying, walling in, or otherwise removing the terminal every round as there's no systems preventing this (plus we now have to consider specific gamerules for maps which to my knowledge no other gamerule has to do or will).
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Yup, this is the big question with a "capture the point" objective and it's been a struggle since captains were throwing the nuke disk out of airlocks on Goon.
If this is impossible to solve then it means modes like this simply cannot work, which would be a bit concerning as it limits SS round design space significantly.
To be honest though I'm stumped on how to solve this further. It's really hard to solve powergaming/metagaming.
On the game rule for maps side: this needs map support to work because it requires the Terminal be put on all maps, and it's possible that there's simply no appropriate place on a current map for a terminal without remapping work that a mapper might not be available to do.
I've heard it proposed that any Communications Computer maybe could be used to do this, but I'll want to workshop that idea properly before being keen on it, as it could make for really annoying rounds where the Revs have stolen or built a console somewhere really asinine (and I want to avoid the Revs building a command hub in maint somewhere as that's a Cult thing)
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I think to prevent walling, maybe you could partially invert the idea and introduce a "dead man's switch" with this console. If nobody interacts with the console using the Head IDs on a regular and partially-randomized timer basis, they could lose control of elements of the station via powernet lockdowns and restrictions on cargo, etc. That at least guarantees that the console must be accessible, at least intermittently if nothing else. It continues to incentivize the seizing of the ID cards, as the only way to stop this altogether is to use the IDs in the console and disengage from CentCom's authority (which is an automatic loss condition for the heads if they do this themselves, naturally, and would probably incur ERT/Deathsquad absent a revolution). It also adds an IC reason for people to believe in the revolution - if the heads keep failing to satisfy their job requirements and the station repeatedly enters lockdowns and restrictions from CentCom, the crew will get progressively more mutinous, with or without the gamemode in play.
Possibly even failing the lockdown timer several times in a row would automatically generate revolutionaries.
This also forces heads to remain on the station and in potential danger - leaving to live on the trade station is not an option for a cowardly Captain.
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Some ideas so far include centralizing some Command functions into the console or building in some of the comms functionality. I do want the Terminal to do something good and cool though, a "oh, cool" moment, not a "oh..." moment.
This is another thing I'm going to try and workshop with designers on the Discord.
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| - A major crew victory if all Head Revs are neutralized, either by death, inprisonment or neutralization\*. If this occurs, all Rev members of staff de-convert and Centcomm (belatedly) detects the mind control rays being blasted at the station, sending an evacuation shuttle and allowing the round to end. (If the surviving chain of command wants a longer round, the shuttle can be recalled). | ||
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Isn't this still the current issue of heads just leaving or roundstalling.
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Maybe - I'm happy to workshop the end-of-round situation for crew victories vs revs.
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I think it's currently fine - Heads hiding leaves room for the revolutionaries to just rush the birdge, giving the Revolutionaries an advantage and Headrevs hiding still results in a crew victory - just a minor one.
The main one I'm iffy about is the draw condition. Doesn't this encourage round removal of all heads you encounter anyways?
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On leaving/roundstalling: I'm going to run this past the desgin discussion area of the Discord for views here.
On the draw condition: maybe; I want to give the Revs an opportunity to fight for a draw if Sec completely outplays them, though.
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That's very fair, I think giving revolutionaries a secondary condition to work towards is a great idea if they fail to get to the bridge. I just don't think it should be killing all heads, as i believe it encourages round removal of heads instead of just killing them for their ID and leaving them there to (maybe) be recovered.
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Agreed, I'll workshop this.
…valuable part of the command structure by CentComm
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i feel like the revs winning instantly after the centcom uplink is severed is a bit of a bad idea, i think that just before it's severed it should send out an alert or something that says something like "hey we at cc think your uplink console is broken so we're sending a replacement board" the remaining loyalist crew should have to re-establish the uplink through the same method that the hrevs cut the uplink before cc decides "oh, you're leaving, goodbye have a good time etc etc" as a sort of "overtime" grace period, it shouldn't be too long (like however long the nuke is) but after that the uplink terminal switches to broadcasting 102.3 SYNDIE FM or smth and the round is over |
| # Important Patches To The Rev Gamemode That Should Go Alongside This Refactor | ||
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| 1. Head Revs are not shown as Head Revs to other Revs. This means a de-Revved crewmember has a slightly harder time IDing them. | ||
| 2. Head Revs have access to the Syndicate radio channel for the purpose of co-ordinating with other Head Revs. This prevents the 1.0 problem where Head Revs would mill about without good direction, leading to boring rounds with early Rev identification by Security. | ||
| 3. (If the Flash/Mindshield meta is still used) A limited number of Mindshields is available from CentComm at any one time. This means that a good loyal Cargo crew cannot end the round rapidly if the Revolution is discovered. After ordering a few, CentComm will need time to make more. |
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What does the fact that headrevs use classic syndicate encryption keys mean for other antagonists that have access to a syndicate key? Right now, it's only thieves with a Syndicate PAI and I believe lone ops, but this may end up more noteworthy if a dynamic gamemode that allows traitors/nukies and revolutionaries is implemented.
Is a single, tappable, communication channel for headrevs intended? Lone ops and Revolutionaries have pretty incompatible objectives.
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Also, if the keys are simple syndicate encryption keys, would this open a new metagaming avenue of unscrewing headsets to confirm headrev status? This would likely also increase the number of times security taps syndicate channels from aquiring a key.
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I'm fine with checking headsets. If it's revs and you find someone with a syndie chip in their headset it's a good in-universe way of identifying a ringleader, and it requires arresting the perp.
For Sec I want their objectives to be to arrest the ringleaders and have a way of dealing with the converted that means still doing their Sec job.
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That makes sense, but I'm slightly worried about the can of worms that might come from headset checking becoming a validhunting tool. We already have endless discussions and rule clarifications about implant checking and emag checking borgs after all.
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That's fair. I'm considering giving Head Revs direct access to syndie radio as an innate ability - the same innate hacking ability that gives them the ability to unlink the station - so it can't be diagnosed via headset.
| In Revolutionary rounds, the Terminal can be exploited by a Head Revolutionary to initiate an unlinking sequence. This unlinking sequence works as follows: | ||
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| 1. The Head Revolutionary gets at least one Head ID card. | ||
| 2. The Head Revolutionary breaks into the room with the terminal in it (probably the bridge). | ||
| 3. The Head Revolutionary\* inserts the ID card into the terminal. | ||
| 4. The Head Revolutionary waits through the timer. | ||
| 5. If the Head Revolutionary has any more Head ID cards, they can insert them to decrease the length of the timer. | ||
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| This timer blares out a warning that the station is being unlinked when the timer starts, with the time remaining. If the time remaining is modified (by inserting more ID cards), this is also announced. | ||
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| Any crew member can stop the countdown by interacting with the terminal and clicking a big obvious red flashing button on it. This stops the timer\*\*. | ||
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| If the timer reaches zero, the Revolutionaries win and a round restart is called. The Head Revolutionaries exploit the console to disable all security ~~ready for the Syndicate to show up~~ to free the crew from their corporate overlords and install themselves as "Consuls" of the station\*\*\*. Remaining living department heads and security officers are renamed "Enemies of the Revolution" and are ultra-valid, although given that the game is in end-of-round the murder has probably already started. |
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This design doc highlights that one of the main issues of revolutionaries is murderboning, but doesn't this climax inevitably result in a large chunk of players getting round removed from said murderboning?
Security will have to use lethals against a revolution this far in, and obviously revs will fight back, most likely resulting in a very large ammount of casualties. If heads win, everyone deconverts which allows the station to treat the wounded, but if a headrev escapes/hides, wouldn't the heads be kind of forced to leave the revs to rot?
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Murderboning: Yes, but it's the finale of the round. If the revs lose the bridge then they've probably lost and are on the run. It's more fun to die at an interesting finale point and watch the mop-up from ghosting than dying at the half-way point.
Leaving folks to rot: Under the MindShield meta: no, as deconversion of a corpse means reviving them and sticking a shield in their brain. Other mechanics will work differently but I'm hoping whatever is agreed on gives security an AOE way of dealing with the converted.
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| _\*Revolutionaries can insert cards. It's also possible that they could activate the timer, but this needs playtesting._ | ||
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| _\*\*The timer might reset to its starting value or might hold its starting value, so if restarted it continues counting down. This needs playtesting._ |
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This is labeled as a TBD but since pressing the button is instantaneous, wouldn't reseting the cooldown lead to a ton of hail mary plays where a non-rev runs into the bridge, presses the cancel button and dies in order to get more time?
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Yep. It'll need playtesting. I'd probably prefer something like "the uplink's been switched off - it'll now tick back up to its maximum timer" so if it's a suicide tider stopping it then the HR can just restart it.
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| - A major crew victory if all Head Revs are neutralized, either by death, inprisonment or neutralization\*. If this occurs, all Rev members of staff de-convert and Centcomm (belatedly) detects the mind control rays being blasted at the station, sending an evacuation shuttle and allowing the round to end. (If the surviving chain of command wants a longer round, the shuttle can be recalled). | ||
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I think it's currently fine - Heads hiding leaves room for the revolutionaries to just rush the birdge, giving the Revolutionaries an advantage and Headrevs hiding still results in a crew victory - just a minor one.
The main one I'm iffy about is the draw condition. Doesn't this encourage round removal of all heads you encounter anyways?
| ## (It is not infinitely robust) | ||
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| If the terminal is destroyed (except by nuke) then CentComm will send an automated annoyed message to the crew and send a replacement computer board to the automated trade station. This is absolutely a way that the Revolution could game the system, but considering that they'd need to do something very drastic to do so... |
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Wouldn't this encourage revolutionaries to break the rules and singuloose in order to move the terminal to a more convenient location?
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"We overthrew Nanotrasen and only had to tesloose to do it" is pretty funny. It should be a call to the HRs to make each round how they want to tackle overthrowing the station, and having an out if shenanigans or metagaming have made storming the bridge impossible need to be in the design.
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I'm pretty sure doing this is against the rules currently, I believe revolutionaries aren't meant to be causing station-wide damage (You even say it yourself in the overview - the goal of the revs is to deliver the station, mostly intact, to the syndicate).
I'm not against preventive measures to avoid metagaming from the heads, but fighting it with metagaming from the revs feels like a pitfall just ready to cause a ton of issues.
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This might not be completely fixable (limits in sandbox game == hard) but I get your point. Fundamentally any objective-based game mode has to handle "ok, so what happens if the objective has been rendered impossible".
The trick is making a countermeasure without causing a negative play experience via someone gaming the system.
I'm gonna try and organize a design discussion on this and see what comes out, as I'm capped out on ideas here.
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This might not be the best way to handle it, but can't we just make it work in the same way as other currently indestructible objects? (AKA nuke disk and nuke)
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That was my thought too. Indestructible seems like a simple solution
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Could make it surrounded in a bubble that bounces the singulo/tesla like the containment field does.
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I'll be workshopping this on the Discord over the next couple of nights. |
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Oops I accidentally refactored chat |
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Couple of quick points:
I might have a go writing a demo of this on my honk-station-14 repo once chatfactor is in a good place |
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Oh and 3. I'm thinking that the solution of most of this is making the Uplink on the bridge (or an equivalent secure location) the easiest way to break the uplink with Centcomm, but it be possible to assemble a machine to override the uplink elsewhere. The replacement uplink would be a big dumb machine that needs resources and a significant amount of power to work. It would need: Some anomaly cores (i.e. needing Sci) Once the machine is constructed it can then circumvent any need for any Head IDs at all by blasting a pure wave of space magic at the uplink, severing it and The uplink severance process via this constructed machine is long, probably about ten minutes, but it forces the station's loyalists to play an active game both mid- and end-game. This does unfortunately mean that we're walking a bit into Cult's territory, as "setting up a secret project in the maint bar to utterly fuck over the station" is their thing. But after a lot of thought on how to tackle this for a few weeks, I can't really think of a good alternative win condition for Revs which is fluffy, isn't arbitrary handwavium bullshit and actually can be developed by the dev team. I also like this as having two win conditions for Revs means it mirrors Nukies, who have two win conditions they can be gunning for (either their own nuke or the station's). |
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Closing as stale |
Operative: you will be going deep undercover at the new Nanotransen research lab we have uncovered in the sector. Your objective is to seize control of the space station from those unsuspecting fools so we may use it and its crew for our own ends. Compromise their chain of command and use their identification to destroy their security systems contained in their Uplink Terminal. You may use any method at your disposal to achieve this end. Be aware that Nanotrasen security teams are sufficiently armed to pose you difficulties if your objective is discovered too early.
Good luck, operative. Long live the revolution.
Revolutionaries 2.0: The CentComm Uplink Console
Overview
Revolutionaries is a classic Space Station 13 game mode, updated and revised for maximum chaotic fun. A cabal of Head Revolutionaries, specialist infiltrators from the Syndicate, have sneaked aboard the Space Station. Their job: deliver the space station into Syndie hands.
To do this, the Head Revolutionaries need to compromise the central security framework that controls and monitors the space station. This is done by obtaining, by any means, one or more Department Head IDs, breaking into the bridge, and hacking into the CentComm Uplink Terminal. After a timer, shortened each time a new Head ID is inserted into the machine, the Revolutionaries gain complete control over the station and win the round.
If the Head Revolutionaries are neutralized before this happens, CentComm will send a dismissable emergency shuttle to pick up the crew.
Background
The current Revolutionaries game mode ("Revs") as implemented is a problematic game mode that has lead to:
Revs is badly in need of a refactor to encourage a more dynamic round that encourages paranoia from Security and smart play from the Revolutionaries. This document forms one half of the "Revs 2.0" refactor, alongside a to-be-written replacement of the Flash/MindShield conversion game mechanics. For the original overview document, see here.
TL;DR
The current "kill all Heads" win condition for Revolutionaries is replaced.
The bridge Communications Computer is upgraded to a Centcomm Security Uplink terminal.
This terminal is pretty hard to destroy, internally-powered, bolted to the floor and very heavy. If the terminal somehow gets destroyed (a Singuloose, immovable rod, etc) then CentComm will detect this and dispatch the needed machine board to make another to the trade station.
This Computer works like a Communications Computer, but represents the station's connection to CentComm. This connection can be switched off by inserting one of a set of keycards: one of the original Department Head IDs (but not the Captain's spare). This starts a timer. Each additional Head ID reduces this timer. The timer can be disabled by accessing the terminal and cancelling it.
If this timer expires, and it's a Revs round, the Revs win. Even if it isn't, all cards on the station automatically become All Access.